Joe's advice is in our opinion bad and unsafe. That would be useful additional information to document. Will snapmore pix when I can drag myself away from computer. There is no and was no GTE-Sylvania Zinsco electrical panel recall that would help you out with replacement costs. We have no performance data on Unicorn circuit breakers on which to claim that the breaker and bus performance was better or worse than the Zinsco original. Zinsco electrical panels were distributed in the United States, primarily in the Western states. Also is there a place where I can research to find out if my panels were officially recalled? Clockwise from upper left: Compare these to other circuit breakers or to other Zinsco breakers in this article series. Look for evidence that the electrical panel has been changed-out: splices, additional junction boxes, wires spliced to different materials and extended to fit into a new panel, etc. Since Milbank still uses a Zinsco design breaker, prefer to keep them on my "do not buy" list. They have stopped making Federal Panels anyway.Im not sure what the best policy is here, but this much is true: I should simply say yes change these panels, but I know for sure someone will challenge that and it would be better to have reasons. However, no inspector should ignore the numerous cases of Zinscos breakers going bad. Thanks again for your help and eagle eyes! I saw this listed as 50A but am doubtful. Cost to Replace a Zinsco-Sylvania Electrical Panel? According to usinspect.com, problems with Zinsco Panels . Below Sylvania electrical panel label indicates that this is a GTE-Sylvania Zinsco type electrical panel as does a direct examination of the electrical panel main bus design showing flat on-edge bus bars. It seems that the problems stem from aluminum parts within the panel. @Robert shaner, However, these replacement breakers can also malfunction, and there is no known proof that they will be more reliable and safe than the older models. This was because the threads on the bus bar were poorly manufactured and the electricians installing them would tighten it down, but not realize that the bolt was carrying the main current due to the gap. Insurance companies have become increasingly cautious when signing insurance for older properties with FPE or Zinsco installed. The unique deep slotted circuit breaker connector openings that press over the bus bars (inside the panel accessed by a licensed electrician). When these panels experience a short circuit or an overcurrent, they often fail to cut the power supply to the affected circuit. Victor [by private email] 10 September 2015. Federal Pacific Electrical Panels, often known as FPE Stab Lok panels, are a type of electrical panel manufactured by Federal Pacific. As a homeowner, you are liable when someone is injured on your property, especially if the harm was foreseeable. I've been conducting professional home inspections since 2002. Watch out: you will also find some 30A - Black toggle Zinsco breakers and 20A black-toggled GFCI breakers that, as you'll see illustrated below on this page. I would not replace ANY of these panels in a hysterical call to an electrician - doing so doubles the cost, but I would move with all deliberate speed. Use GTE Sylvania Circuit Breakers type Q, QC, AFP, R38, RC38, and HRGF. There is among electricians an endemic problem common to everyone working in contracting: an unfamiliarity with solid technical research sometimes leads folks to assert that nothing was wrong with product X except that it was the nature of the times in which it was made or installed. where we discuss, among other topics, Below: more examples of labels found in GTE-Sylvania-Zinsco electrical panels. mobile home doors that open properly - all buildings need safe functional fire exit passages, Turning off any strange-behaving circuits (flickering lights) with the caveat than in an FP/FPE case "turning off" may actually leave the circuit on as the breaker may not switch off internally), Red and blue breaker switches with visible colored base, Oblong opening at wire connection terminal, Flat electrical panel bus bars in parallel fitting into two slots on each breaker, Oblong opening in plastic receiver of bus bar ends, Vertical arrows point to the flat electrical panel bus bars of a Zinsco electrical panel. They may be the same design with a different sticker on top. Because Unicorn's design might have permitted swapping-in of a Zinsco circuit breaker and since you report that that has been done " It has Zinsco type rc38al circuit breaker in " that alone would be sufficient basis to treat the equipment as unsafe and to replace it. Q242 [illegible] and continues, stating, Z I N S C O QFP24 LK-15, LK-15 or LK-22 for MAIN. Again you guys are great for helping out! Concerns raised simply by inspection of your photos include. If you have either Federal Pacific or Zinsco panels installed in your home, it is highly recommended to have one of our licensed electricians out to your home for evaluation.We will inspect your electrical panel for FREE. Thanks! zinsco still make 35 amp breakers? Like Zinsco, it brought safety hazards and was recalled. Never insert any tool nor your fingers into the interior of an electrical panel. I'd like to have seen a view of the actual circuit breaker from its side or a view of the metal bus bar to which the breakers connect as that will give an absolute identification. The full size is type Q and the two ploes are type QC. Questions & answers about the identification of Zinsco, Sylvania-Zinsco, and Kearney Electrical Panels - Zinsco-look alike Electrical Panels and Circuit Breakers. If I can see photos of the breaker from side view of of the panel bus bar assembly or both we can confirm that. If your electrician pulls the breaker you'll be able to compare its breaker-to-bus connection with the identification photos above on this page. Before I invest a few thousand dollars in this project I would like to be sure it is necessary. Sean. Zinsco panels may not meet today's updated safety codes. It turns out as I'm reading your article, you cite someone named James Simmons from Mr Electric. An electrician needs to look with care at this panel for any immediate safety hazards, pending its replacement. Aluminum Enters the Picture. Original breakers were patented in 1950 and labeled "Magnatrip." Five additional patents would be issued for subsequent designs. Sometimes that's true. Zinsco breakers are known to not trip in the presence of overcurrent or short circuits. GTE Sylvania Circuit Breakers Type Q, QC, QFP, R38, RC38, & HRGF. The word Zinsco on the panel door tag, on panel labels or data tags (Zinsco panel label photo above). Replacing the panel can help improve the electrical systems overall performance and ensure it functions correctly. I wanted corroboration so I could be sure I wasn't buying something that I really didn't need. Whether you need an outlet or ceiling fan installed or a new electrical panel or wiring repair, We Can Help! The company was sold in 1973 to GTE- Sylvania, who continued to manufacture breakers and panels to the original Zinsco design for some years; this product line is now discontinued. That's probably what you've got. REally appreciate your feedback(wow, and quick too!). Arrows point to points of identification characteristic of Zinsco breakers. Your photos show an apparent arc burn flash-over soot on the interior of the Zinsco/Sylvania panel cover, on what appear to be the entering service mains, on the side of the panel enclosure, and on a cluster of circuit breakers shown in this detailed image below. Joe JRL Electric Supply said: Be sure to also read HISTORY of ZINSCO ELECTRICAL PANELS. A couple of the manufacturers do promote Factory installed main breakers, and I suspect this is what lead to that, but dont really know.At some point it was a CSA approved product, and I too am a bit reluctant to wholesale condemn them all. Zinsco panels, also known as GTE Sylvania-Zinsco panels. Featuring two 1-pole circuit breakers with separate operating handles, the Leviton Surge Protective Device provides effective surge protection for the entire home without sacrificing space inside the panel. We also provide an ARTICLE INDEX for this topic, or you can try the page top or bottom SEARCH BOX as a quick way to find information you need. . Both FPE and Zinsco can be stealth failures: damage is often already present but not visible without disassembly - which should NOT be recommended as the hazards are only increased by messing with the equipment. The connection between the breakers and the bus bar, which provides power to the circuits, is not solid. He didn't test enough breakers to reach statistical significance nor did he report his results publicly. Plated aluminum bus bars that get gouged-through when a breaker is inserted (mounting a breaker cuts through the plating and we see corrosion, overheats, failures). 20 March 2015. "Basic Housing Inspection," US DHEW, S352.75 U48, p.144, out of print, but is available in most state libraries. It is not a law. 2. I have put them into a gallery here[link deleted] Home Inspection Insider, 200 Amp Wire Size: Residential Service Guide, Bad GFCI Outlet: 13 Things You Should Know, Microwave Breaker Size: Wire & Outlet for Microwave Ovens, 40 Amp Wire Size: Wire & Breaker Size Guide, 30 Amp Wire Size: Wire & Breaker Size Guide. Photo of a recent GTE Sylvania Zinsco circuit breaker burn up courtesy of Jeff Weissman. US $19.5 Free shipping for many products Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 1 Zinsco Rc38-15 RC3815 15 Amp 2 Pole Tandem Twin Circuit Breaker 120/240 VAC at the best online prices at . [Click to enlarge any image], 2. Here we provide text, labels, and equipment photographs used to help identify Zinsco and GTE-Sylvania-Zinsco electrical panels and circuit breakers, and we include photographs of a Zinsco look alike marketed by Kearney. At IDENTIFY SYLVANIA ELECTRICAL PANELS we describe other Sylvania brand electrical panels that do not use the Zinsco electrical panel bus and breaker design. Please see ELECTRIC PANEL AMPACITY for more detailed help in answering your question. Some other factors that will affect the price for replacing a Zinsco panel are: Depending on these and other factors, even newer wiring might need to be installed. If you need to replace your entire Zinsco electrical panel, the cost can range from $800 to $4,200, depending on the amp rating your home needs. Other Zinsco electrical panel identification and information labels are included in this article. Photographs contributed to this website by Jim P. Simmons, Mr. Electric, Licensed Master Electrician, I'm looking to upgrade to 200A with solar system in future but trying to decide if I should replace it now if it's unsafe. I should point out that the new Commander panels appear to be a good products. The Zinsco panel may be under the name of Sylvania, GTE-Sylvania or Kearney. By 1961 Zinsco had switched to an aluminum alloy still used today in their manufacture of panels and load-center busing. (Don't try it.). Zinsco Class Action Lawsuit In 2002, a class-action lawsuit was filed against Federal Pacific Electric and Zinsco regarding the danger posed by their electrical panels. If I were estimating an electrical panel age I would Estimating Electrical Panel Age Now required in the 2020 NEC, panel-level surge protection is key for critical circuits that power equipment in residential applications. Below we show the interior of this 400Amp Zinsco electrical panel. Zinsco is considered unsafe and a serious fire hazard without being officially recognized by the Consumer Products Safety Commission (CPSC). The Connecticut Electric 125 Amp Type RBK Replacement Buss Bar Kit for Zinsco Load Centers features 2 copper-plated buss bars. The bottom breaker on the top group of circuits will shut off powet to the bottom group of circuits. This website discusses the electrical, fire, and shock hazards associated with Zinsco electrical components, We include photos of Zinsco breaker labels and other markings that identify Zinsco and Kearney electrical equipment. Photo courtesy Tim Hemm cited at references at the end of these articles. The most common amperages are from 15 to 30 amp. So, what breakers are compatible with Zinsco? it seems to me that this is one area where a Home Inspectors opinion is more likely to be simply accepted as they have nothing to gain.I have never heard of Kearney [DF NOTE: I do NOT recommend this obsolete publication, though it was cited in the original. I have personally experienced it over 20 times for overcurrent situations and about 5 times in fault current situations. Only one image can be added per comment but you can post as many comments, and therefore images, as you like. (Obsolete, not recommended), Personal communication, J. Aronstein to D. Friedman, 3/6/2006, James P. Simmons: Personal communication and photographs used in this article series, J. Simmons to Daniel Friedman, 3/4/2006, 2/19/2008. Yes, this house is indeed in Fairfax. Below is an enlargement of the the bus-connection section of a classic Zinsco circuit breaker - showing the difference between these devices. 200 amps - $1,300 to $2,600. I will do another post with another picture. Notice those two vertical strips that connect to two deep slots in the circuit breaker? An interlock arrangement insures that the cam element can not be removed without the breaker being automatically tripped. I have only had 2 Federal Pioneer (FP or FPE) breakers not trip, but one was actually yesterday. Your panel photo so tiny I can't see much, but those red and light blue (?) Instead the generator is connected to the panel THROUGH a transfer switch - an "either-or" type switch that makes certain that both power systems are not ever turned on simultaneously. No votes so far! I am sending you a picture, can you tell if it needs to be replaced? Maybe try again; type in the Comment box, then click the "Add Image" button to select an image file from your computer or smartphone or tablet. Watch out: replacement circuit breakers that have been tested for these problem brands have generally performed no better than the originals. We include photos of Zinsco breaker labels and other markings that identify Zinsco and Kearney electrical equipment. The inside box is a Zinsco/Sylvania model number 20-5x (7-14). It looks like I have the unsafe Sylvania GTE panel. Aluminum has a useful life of approximately 30 years. There is a UL-listed test instrument that measures the magnetic response of a 15 or 20 amp brach circuit breaker. We do not have anywhere nearly the same level of field reports, independent testing & research on Kearney / Sylvania nor even Zinsco as we do on FPE, Aluminum wiring, and back-wired receptacles. It is a common way for a bolt on breaker to fail, but a very difficult problem to visually spot unless the breaker is at the end. Pushmatic. Connecticut Electric offers Zinsco breaker replacements. I'm looking for information on a Zinsco single-phase 400A, 240VAC panelboard with a DS-4564 designation. Yes your electrical panel is indeed the Zinsco-Sylvania design, that we can see in both labeling and in the unique Zinsco breaker and bus design that shows deep slots into the breaker that slide over vertical edges of the bus bars in the electrical panel. We are changing the panel Monday. This means the breaker can't ever trip, even when there's a short or overloaded circuit. The younger Zinsmeyer took over the company from his father in 1943 and renamed it Zinsco. Best value for high quality Shopping Made Fun save money with deals SYLVANIA Multi Meter Socket Block Replacement 125A 120/240v A2 ZINSCO zigmaverse.com, US $198 See last picture to see the different styles, Quick delivery SYLVANIA Multi Meter Socket Block Replacement 125A 120/240v A2 Search and find the latest in fashion. ---- I am always very careful what I say as many people quickly jump to conclusions that I am upselling or Fear marketing. (Photos below), Shown above in a very crowded collection of circuit breakers we see two-pole Zinsco RC half-sized breakers in three different amperages. 2, 225 AMPS Max. Check the Breaker for Damage It's Best to Replace the Entire Panel Conclusion Ways to Remove a Zinsco Breaker Model# is MT12MBB and House was built in 1977 in San Mateo County, California, USA. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Zinsco 100 or 125 amp residential Dead Front cover Sylvania GTE. In 1973, GTE-Sylvania (same owners of Zinsco) introduced their own panel and breaker design. The panel labels may identify it as "Sylvania", Sylvania-Zinsco, or GTE-Sylvania-Zinsco. by Unicorn electrical products? - Vertical or "on edge" electrical panel bus bars identify a Zinsco design. 40 A - Light Gray Toggle Handle Part # RC38-40, 50A - Black Toggles, Part # RC38-50 - shown above, 60A - White Toggle or handle, Part # RC38-60 (not shown in the photo above). MLB20(12-24)C (Indoor) Mod. It would be prudent to replace it. 400 amps - $2,300 to $4,200. In older homes, there are still some electrical panel brands that have been commonly known to fail at safety standards. unused, Condition:: New: A brand-new. An expert who opens the electrical panel or performs further disassembly (DANGEROUS STEP) can further identify the characteristic circuit breaker details but the circuit breaker The instructions say to use certain Zinsco breakers to replace the original ones. They were legal during the installation and are still legal according to the standard in place at the time of installation. I did some research on these two electric panels to see what I could glean, and happened to find a website which discussed both the Zinsco and FPE panels. Without more investigation of the breakers, panel bus, and circuit involved one cannot say for certain if this arc-flash damage was due to a defect in the circuit breaker, panel bus, connections, or some other issue. IDENTIFY ZINSCO ELECTRICAL PANELS at InspectApedia.com - online encyclopedia of building & environmental inspection, testing, diagnosis, repair, & problem prevention advice. 390-205-09 on a label which has the bottom left corner torn off. I'm dealing with this problem in my home currently, I have both my HVAC and an electrician here. Zinsco electrical panels were distributed in the United States, primarily in the Western states. Production of Zinsco panels halted in mid-1970s. Below are links to pictures of my electrical panel. The unique vertical thin-edged bus bars (aluminum, plated aluminum, or in older Zinsco panels copper bus bars (inside the panel accessed by a licensed electrician). Product information Technical Details Additional Information Warranty & Support Even if you replace the circuit breakers, the risk from the panel itself will still be present. @Robert shaner, If you have a property with a Zinsco box installed, this might lead to your insurance coverage being canceled. Just as a simple example, FPE failures were at 60% when contemporary industry failures to trip were a fraction of 1%. These are also called cheater breakers. "Electrical System Inspection Basics," Richard C. Wolcott, ASHI 8th Annual Education Conference, Boston 1985. Zinsco electrical panels are obsolete. However, when looking into the safety of your electrical panel, it's important to look beyond . The half Size is R38 for 1 poles and RC38 for 2 poles. Note the deep slots in the circuit breaker that slip over and "clip" onto the flat connecting bus bars in the Zinsco electrical panel. @Robert shaner, Use GTE Sylvania Circuit Breakers Type Q, QC, R38, RC38,and HRGF. Although the breaker appears to be off, internally, the panel may still be conducting power. Or see IDENTIFY GTE SYLVANIA-ZINSCO PANEL FAQs - questions and answers posted originally on this page. Challenger panels made by Challenger Electrical Equipment Corp or Eaton/Cutler Hammer. Bottom lien: I'm interested in seeing sharp and more-detailed photos of any evidence of the details of burning in the panel that you were describing. Depending on the panel's amperage (150A or 200A panels will cost more), additional electrical upgrades may also be necessary. Apologies for the delay. HOW TO WIRE UP an ELECTRIC GENERATOR and ISOLATION SWITCH REQUIREMENTS, On 2020-12-04 by BW Simmons The characteristic colored Zinsco red, green, blue, gray & white toggle switches on the circuit breakers in the Zinsco electrical panel. Guess I had bettertalk to our electrical contractor :(. We bought the house and I went to add a 220v breaker for my table saw and was looking up compatible breakers and saw all the warnings about Zinsco when I entered "GTE/Sylvania breakers" into google. the circuit breaker colors and other external details permit the inspector to identify the problem Zinsco-design electrical panel bus and circuit breaker materials. The Challenger panel was installed in thousands of homes between 1980s to 1990s. Below is a Zinsco HQGF20 GFCI circuit breaker with a black toggle switch. The Zinsco panels may work for years, but there is an underlying threat as homes have increased energy demands, these panels may overheat and breaker failure can occur. 15 amp has Blue Handles Part # R38-15 20 Amp has Red Handles Part # R38-20 30 Amp has Green Handles Part # R38-30 The Zinsco electrical panel problems are well-documented, with extensive field reports concerning the failure of Zinsco and Zinsco-Sylvania panels. I was skeptical, figuring he was trying to upsell me. Thank you for your information. Mary They were once a popular product to have installed in homes. The following remarks from a licensed electrician were provided to us courtesy of Al Carson, Carson Dunlop Associates, a Toronto home inspection and home inspection education firm. The Zinsco panel exterior is shown above and in close-up below. An expert who opens the electrical There is live voltage in the panel interior - you could be shocked or killed. Because the Challenger panel was very similar in design to Zinsco's . Due to significant flaws in the design of the panels, after wear and tear of the breaker, the breaker and aluminum bars in the Zinsco panel melt together. He was recommended to me by a friend who's in contracting locally. Research is underway. Please bookmark this page to make it easy for you to check back for our response. Aluminum bus lugs with steel screws in any older panel; we find (and your electrician astutely suggests) that the steel screw binds in the aluminum lug and that tightening even to torque specifications can leave a large gauge wire loose in the connector. Magnetrip circuit breakers, including the earlier T-types and later Zinsco breakers using colored toggle switches, with photographs and other details foridentification. No. Often the panel manufacture date is stamped on the panel labeling but not always and not in a consistent patterns. 5. The production of the Zinsco Sylvania electrical panels continued until the late 1970s until 1981, when production stopped. Completely by coincidence I happen to have gotten my hands on a Mr. Electric electrician today. Brief History of Zinsco Emile Zinsmeyer started Zinsmeyer Co right after the stock market crash of 1929. So don't assume that all-black breakers can be excluded from this unsafe Zinsco circuit breaker group. He's doing a great job. 2, Type 1 Enclosure, 125A Max.. GTE Sylvania Circuit Breakers Type Q, QC, R38, RC38 & HRGF. Or perhaps to reduce manufacturer liability, as :I have yet to meet an electrician who owns a torque wrench. I'll attach "Had to" is a technical opinion with which I agree. Once I found your website we started to take a different path. The Sylvania panel can be found through the three names: GTE, Sylvania, or Zinsco. undamaged item in its original packaging (where packaging is applicable). Watch out: the panel looks corroded, rusty, unreliable as a brand-independent hazard, and of course Zinsco breakers and panels are unsafe in any event. Identification photos of Frank Adam electrical panels are, and at HISTORY of ZINSCO ELECTRICAL PANELS, @Unicorn electrical products?, Max.. GTE Sylvania circuit breakers Type Q, QC, QFP, R38, RC38 & HRGF that... We discuss, among other topics, below: more examples of labels found in GTE-Sylvania-Zinsco electrical,. 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